Tuesday, September 05, 2006

Jesus Camp - The Movie

Going out on a limb here, but I reckon this film is going to kick up a whole load of dirt before it reaches the UK. So I am asking our US based friends if they have seen any previews yet. I see it opens across the States on Sept 15.

I would really like to hear any reviews as I cannot find a UK release date or DVD release date yet. You can watch a trailer above, there is a review on AnitaRoddicks (Body Shop) site at www.anitaroddick.com.

But her article is really her comment on David Byrne's article from his journal at www.journal.davidbyrne.com, and yes that is the David B of Talking Heads fame.

The films can be found at www.lokifilms.com and also at www.jesuscampthemovie.com.
Go to the above link to watch trailers...

20 comments:

Meg said...

Here's a link to another review of the movie, fairly extensive: www.imdb.com/title/tt0486358.

I use Internet Movie Database (a secular site) or, more frequently, www.family.org (Dr. James Dobson's "Plugged In" section, a Christian site) for movie evaluations.

Frankly, for a movie that's going to be released here in the States on Sept. 15 (!?), I've neither seen nor heard any advertising at all for it. I wonder why... Maybe it's because they're gearing up for the 9/11 remembrance stuff right now. I watch TV (mostly Fox rather than the networks) and I listen to U.S. and Canadian radio stations, since both are equally accessible where I live. I also read the local print media. Your mention of this movie is the first I've even heard of it. There's been no mention of it, at least nothing that I've heard here in the northern Midwest.

Meg said...

...I continue:
I looked at the websites and the trailer for this documentary and am left extremely puzzled. As far as I know, this kind of stuff is not taking place here. I live in a large (5 million people), northern metropolitan area where "the man on the street" is generally hostile to evangelical Christianity. However, I've visited the South and the West enough to know that the entire premise of the "Jesus Camp" is sheer bunkum. Ain't happening. That said, okay, there is a book out there called "The Second Mayflower" and it advocates Christians seceding from the U.S. and forming another country. (I own this book.) It's been proposed that we get South Carolina and just leave the Union. I like this idea except that the climate in SC is a bit steamy for me. I do like the waist-high snow that we occasionally get up here! ;>)

The idea of Christians seeking to impose a theocracy on the U.S. is a hysterical nightmare of the Left in this country. They need to cut down on their Prozac - or at least stop slugging it down with a fifth or so of Stoly - and just plain chill.

Shieldsy said...

Watched the trailer and read the articles.

Seems like a pretty standard pentecostal Bible camp. Of course, picking at a pentecostal Bible camp is easier than picking at a Madrassas.

These sort of camps have been running for generations and as far as I'm aware they haven't produced a single evangelical suicide bomber. The Madrassas however ...

I'm not always comfortable about some of the emotionally laden language that's used around the children because of their succeptability ... but compared to the stuff that's preached by their Islamic counterparts it's tame!

But evangelicals will/have become have the new bogey man because it's much easier & safer to criticise them.

Dave said...

This is of course only a tiny minority in a country of 260 million? These also never produce Christian suicide bombers, but then again we don't really need to, we can just bomb the crap out of people large scale. The reason we get suicide bombers is because they cannot fight a war by parking a flotilla of ships off our coast, launching thousands of cruise missiles and sending 150,000 troops.


This particular group/camp is just another cult, their message, if consistent with the trailer, has nothing to do with Jesus and his Kingdom, and everything to do with pharisaical mind control.

I would not send my child to one, and yet I fear that this camp is a reflection of many 'grown up' groups. I heard my last pastor, an American, declare from the pulpit 'I love my President', I think the whole question comes down to the question of church and state.

dinsy said...

If "a pretty standard pentecostal Bible camp" includes praying in front of a life size cardboard cutout of George W. then there is something seriously wrong with standard Pentecostal bible camps.

Dave said...

Got a reply today about this film, it said...

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the interest in Jesus Camp. Unfortunately, we do not have any plans to screen the film in the UK. However, I will add you to our mailing list and will advise if the film will be screening there. I will also let you know when the movie is available on DVD
(probably sometime next spring) and will let you know how to obtain a copy. Please let me know if there is anything else I can do for you.

--
Christina Gonzalez
Associate Producer
Loki Films

Shieldsy said...

If "a pretty standard pentecostal Bible camp" includes praying in front of a life size cardboard cutout of George W. then there is something seriously wrong with standard Pentecostal bible camps

Context is what is needed. Having never seen the film (which will probably be edited in such a way as to make things look as sinister as possible anyway) none of us can comment informatively. However, I go to a church where we pray for our head of state pretty much every week, and many churches still have a picture of the Queen somewhere about.

Could it be that the cardboard cutout was actually them just encouraging the children to pray for their leaders (something the Bible encourages us to do). And given the fact the Dubya is a Christian (lile him or loathe him) I'd have thought there's even more of an onus on us to pray for him & to encourage children to.

I notice that the trailer has an image of children swearing allegiance to the Christain flag ... again, a pretty standard occurence in many Amercican (espec. pentecostal) churches. Noting more sinister in that the Boy scouts reciting their pledge IMHO.

I'd take issue with you slightly Dave. Many Islamic countries have large conventional armed forces. Pakistan is one of the worlds few nuclear powers. Saudia Arabia, Jordan, Egypt, Iran and others all have well equiped militaries. Islamic terrorism has nothing to do with an inability to fight a conventional war, it is about trying to establish a new worldwide caliphate by whatever means possible and removing all the kafir (infidels).

"This particular group/camp is just another cult, their message, if consistent with the trailer, has nothing to do with Jesus and his Kingdom, and everything to do with pharisaical mind control."

How have you come to that judgement? I'm pretty certain that some secular humanists could accuse my own Kidz Klub of the same if they wanted.

dinsy said...

"children swearing allegiance to the Christain flag" - what is the christian flag? What does it stand for? I never heard of it, or saw one. Don't think I have ever seen a lifesize cardboard cutout of Her Majesty either - she is not so crass, God bless her.

If you have to have (pentecostal bible camp) kids swearing allegiance to anything, should it not be to God?

Shieldsy said...

America's children swear allegiance to their national flag most days of their educational lives. I guess like a lot of things, some bright spark thought they'd do a Christian version. A quick google reveals ...

"I pledge allegiance to the Christian Flag and to the Savior for whose Kingdom it stands. One Savior, crucified, risen, and coming again with life and liberty to all who believe."

I guess it's a sort of creed like most Anglicans chant every week or the Scouts promise.

Dave said...

"This particular group/camp is just another cult, their message, if consistent with the trailer, has nothing to do with Jesus and his Kingdom, and everything to do with pharisaical mind control."

How have you come to that judgement? I'm pretty certain that some secular humanists could accuse my own Kidz Klub of the same if they wanted.


I think we often think of cults in terms of false teaching. If that were the case then many 'christian ministries' would be classed as cults (ie; Creflo Dollar claiming Jesus became God only at his anointing or baptism!).
Cults are often where mind control is used, and whilst I have not seen this film, I would stake my entire Tupperware picnic set that there is emotinal and psychological manipulation going on. I have been involved in two cults, and maybe this should form a separate post, but the way cults operate is reflected even in those short clips.

I have a tape on authority cults, I will try and copy it to a .wav file.

dinsy said...

So how do these kids manage to swear allegiance to their nation (national flag) and to God (christian flag) at the same time - perhaps they don't teach "no one can serve two masters" in these camps?

Oh and by the way, the Queen IS the head of the church in some of whose buildings her picture is present. Seeing as church and state are supposed to be separate in the USA, don't think Bush can be head of anything spiritual, and fortunately we don't see pictures of Tony in any churches in the UK do we?

Meg said...

I don't observe any well-organized or deep devotion to GWB among conservative evangelicals in this country. If anything, most of us are deeply disappointed in him due in part to his policies regarding the borders (one of which I live 20 miles from) and to his irresponsible spending (he's anything but a good steward). I voted for him twice; I was suspect of his Christian profession, but the alternatives in 2000 and 2004 left me no choice.

Many of us still doubt his actual Christianity. Few of us who are what are known as paleoconservatives in this country would vote for Bush again. I thank the Lord for the Constitutional amendment that prevents a third term for him. He's little better than the liberal-leaning neocon that his father was.

Please don't accept at face value everything that you read over there about the politics of evangelical Christians in the States. Most of it simply isn't true.

Shieldsy said...

"So how do these kids manage to swear allegiance to their nation (national flag) and to God (christian flag) at the same time - perhaps they don't teach "no one can serve two masters" in these camps?
"


Don't see anything contradictory about plegding an allegiance to a nation and to God. Neither do most people ... otherwise Christians wouldn't be allowed to join the military or the civil service or become MP's because they all have to swear allegiance to the crown. Or maybe the "2 masters" things has never occured to anyone else before or to the millions of Christians in the USA who make their pledges frequently throughout the year! Or to the countless millions in other countries who have to make nationalistic pledges.

"Oh and by the way, the Queen IS the head of the church in some of whose buildings her picture is present. Seeing as church and state are supposed to be separate in the USA, don't think Bush can be head of anything spiritual, and fortunately we don't see pictures of Tony in any churches in the UK do we?"

Don't understand the relevance of this! Where did I claim Dubya was a spiritual head? The Queen is also - like Dubya - the head of state. The prayer that we pray for our head of state says, "bless our Sovereign Lady, Queen Elizabeth, and all who are in authority under her", which basically means her government (i.e. Mr Blair). I've used images of people during our prayers with the children. I like the idea of getting lifesize Cardboard characters - might pinch that idea for my own ministry. Anyone know where I get one of Tony?

"I would stake my entire Tupperware picnic set that there is emotinal and psychological manipulation going on"

How come anything that affects the emotions is considered 'manipulation'. Really against this idea that the gospel should only appeal to the intellect ... how utterly Anglican is that! It should have an effect on our emotions and our mentality too. As a children's worker I know that we have got to be very cautious of abusing our position of authority & trust, but I certainly hope to have an impact on the children's emotions. And the whole of any spiritual response can probably be reduced to a psycological effect at some level. I know there are a lot of people who still think classic Pentacostalism is a cult, but think it's very sad that we'd condemn another Christian ministry on such flimsy evidence. Trust you'll be happy for the Lord to judge the whole of your Christianity on a few clips from a trailer made by a secular producer with a different agenda?!

Have a read of "Children of Revival" by Pastor Vann Lane of Pensacola AOG if you want to get some idea of another Pentecostal children's ministry. Very interesting & challenging.

dinsy said...

"Anyone know where I get one (cardboard cutout) of Tony?"

I should start looking for one of Gordon if I was you - you'll probably be needing it soon!

Shieldsy said...

Good point Dinsy! Or maybe I should get some faceless beaurocrat figures since it's them who really set the agenda from their ivory towers in brussels. Ooo ... bit political!!

Dave said...

Hey that takes us nicely back to a cardboard cut out of George, he is the one who rules the world...or is there someone pulling his strings?

Meg said...

GWB's strings are pulled by Freemason cronies of "Bush 41," the entire moderate/liberal wing of the Republican party, and the faux Christians who comprise the so-called evangelical elite in this country. I could name names, but "it probably wouldn't be prudent."

Chuck said...

Happened by your blog by chance. I saw Jesus Camp a few months ago (here's my review). To answer Meg's first comment, I doubt JC will get much of an advertising blitz because it's a documentary, and the "opening night" may in fact be only for select cities.

The film fails to disclose that the camp is Pentecostal rather than strictly evangelical, and it also serves a portrait of a specific moment in time (close to the 2004 election campaign) when views were particularly galvanized. I'd imagine that Katrina and the war have cut into W's support even among Pentecostals.

But the film is well worth watching if only because it does illuminate how large groups of people can get a much different (wrong) picture of science, global warming, etc. At the same time, I'd like to believe that the kids themselves are engaging with the lessons they're being taught in a much more sophitsicated manner than Byrne's review suggests.

Dave said...

Thanks Chuck, have checked your web and will read some of the comments later, glad you found us, your review is valuable...thanks Dave

Chuck said...

So, I could be wrong about that advertising blitz. I've never had so many referrals to my blog over any film, no matter how controversial.

 

Free Blog Counter