Wednesday, May 17, 2006

Da-Vinci Cod and R.E.M

Sorry, should that have said Da-Vinci Code, I just thought the idea of searching for a hidden fish would be far more exciting and probably a bit easier to find, the smell and all that.
I just wanted to add my bit to the argument that seems to be raging all over the web and the world.

Now lets make it clear, I have never read the book nor have I seen the film, I did look at 'The Bible Code' book once, so I know all about 'secret' information. To be honest though I don't really like murder/mystery stuff, and all that Holy Grail stuff is so tired, who really gives a damn which cup Jesus drank from.

I read it has sold over 60 million copies so it appears Dan Brown has done very nicely from this, and the whole conspiracy thing has gone on for years, so this just adds a bit more to the debate, to the endless going round in circles, decade upon decade people search for the secret knowledge, century upon century the rumours of Jesus and Mary, children, Holy Grail, Shrouds etc goes on and on.

Now that we have the internet it spreads all the quicker, over these last few weeks I have been looking at many websites from the 'Evolution vs Creation' debate to 'Did Jesus Even Exist' and everyone seeks after truth, as Pilate asked 'What is truth?', and so the debates and arguments go on, and even within Christendom, things like Emergent vs ??? etc...but more to come on that later.

So you may be wondering what has this got to do with Da Vinci, and why R.E.M in the title, well thanks to Dan Brown, (and I do mean thanks) I think I am in the final throes, I hope the death throes, of 'Losing My Religion'. It has been coming for years and years, a gradual realisation that all is junk compared to knowing Jesus, and he is not religion.

So its nearly over I think, after witnessing a 110% miracle over this last week then I am more than ever convinced that religion as we know it is the 'opiate for the masses', so there it is...this was meant to be a funny post about finding smelly fish and it has ended up me sharing a little bit more of my heart.

So believe what you will, go see the film or don't go see it, for in the end it is all futile, its all just chasing rainbows, maybe now I can say like Paul...

God forbid that I should boast about anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ. Because of that cross, my interest in this world died long ago, and the world's interest in me is also long dead.


christian lies said...

Read Da-Vinci Code last year in Italy.

Badly written - conspiracy for the proles.

Opus Die - SEE Ruth whatsit the Minister for Education.

Opus Die see

They are crazies and part of the bloody christian NeoCon gang.

Anonymous said...

Amen. "Religiosity" is not and has never been about the exaltation of the Lord Jesus Christ. Western culture's prevailing philosophy of "it's all about me" currently has even the Church by the throat. So sad.
In another galaxy, light-years past, I was raised and educated in the RCC. It's evil. The RCC is using "The DaVinci Code" and its own "protests" of it to further its agenda.
See the movie or don't see it? I wouldn't support its creators with my money. The movie and the hoopla about it are, constructively, nothing but more "heathen vs. heathen" folderol.
I don't see the whole "controversy" as being worth the consideration of those who are totally given over to Christ.

- mm

Dave said...

Totally, don't give your money to Dan Brown, he has enough already, and so right about 'its all about me', just in a bookstore earlier and even the bibles are now packaged for specifc people, and yep you might have known, a whole raft of books about the Da V Code.
Like you say it is not even worth the time and expense to examine these things the way Christian Media does, that does not mean we should not give an answer to all who ask.

Thanks MM and hey we may catch up on the chat thingy one day.

Gillian said...

Confession time, i'm reading Angels and Demons by Dan Brown at the moment and really like it. Also, it gets worse, i'm looking forward to reading the Da Vinci code next. But it's not because i hope to learn anything from it, i'm not seeking truths or anything, simply reading for a bit of escapism.

At least i'm not giving Dan Brown any extra ££'s, mum already has the books! Mum and i were discussing this earlier today, she says that by the time you get to the fourth book the it becomes apparent just how fictional it really is, same plot in each book, simply different characters and you can't help but disregard any religious value you may have thought you gained (if any) in the first place.

Will i go and see the movie? Perhaps, if i can escape from the house long enough, and it's the only thing on that i fancy, but i'll probably just wait to see it on TV.

But hey what do i know, i can't wait for the next Harry Potter!

Dave said...

I think Rowling and brown should get together and do a Harry potter and the Holy Grail.
I have heard that as literature the books (Brown's) are not that good, and the movie is getting poor reviews, there are many good books and films out there, but I have neither seen the film or read the books, I would not read it because I rarely read books these days and I may well wait for the DVD to come out.

Shieldsy said...

I like the idea of ignore it, won't make a big difference sort of thinking. And I agree with it up to a point.

Harry Potter on its own won't turn our children to witchcraft & occultism. Da Vinci Code on it's own turn people to gnosticism and anti-clericalism.

However, these things form the backwash of our culture ... just like painters put a wash on their canvas first. Call it 'the spirit of our age' if you like.

There is a definite acceptance of occultism now ... even children's magazines often have a section on spells and tarot. The willingness of people to consider the most incredulous conspiracy theories rather than accept historical proofs.

As I heard someone preach once, there are 2 ways to demolish a building: some catastrophic explosion, or by taking away the foundations 1 brick at a time. The drip, drip, drip effect.

As part of the "one brick at a time" method goes, I think Da Vinci & Harry Potter are doing a pretty good job at doing their part in replacing some hard won Christian cultural values.

Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing ... ?

Dave said...

Your one brick at a time thing is so amazing and so true, and if this is what is happeningthen i pray that when all the bricks have gone, then his people will build once more from the only stone that is left...the Chief Cornerstone

Tuck said...

I was interested in your comment "Evolution versus Creation" you my find more about this on the Revelation TV website, the 2 hour interview of John Macay by Howard Conder. I found it fasinating and certainly thought provoking.

Dave said...

Thanks Tuck, I do not have Sky TV but I will keep out for it appearing elsewhere.

Anonymous said...

I think we're all being a wee bity hard on that old religion don't you think? I mean it is actually a biblical word, no really. Anyone want to give a biblical definition of religion? i think when we have we'll see what an essential thing it really is! Well at least the biblical thing called religion.
Blessings for a fellow in exile in babylon, woops meant england

Gillian said...

What do you think the future holds for our children? Is it just me or when you switch on the TV does it worry you too? I'm not talking about after the watershed, i'm talking about childrens TV.

It was just when Shieldsy mentioned the content of magazines it reminded me of the last time i sat down with the kids to watch a bit of telly. The majority of programmes are about witches and magic etc.

I can understand the appeal to kids, fair enough, but is it all part of a process, first watching a bit of magic and witchcraft on tv, then reading and practising tarot and spellweaving, then onto what? Does it just end there, or will it naturally progress to occultism etc? Individually, sure we're reponsible for our own kids, but it can be difficult when your 3 year old comes home from playgroup telling you about Harry Potter and The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe!

Isn't it about time we had a kids christian channel!

By the way, i watched The Tweenies the other day with the girls, to my surprise they read Noahs Ark, to my shock there was not one mention of God, Noah just knew it was going to rain!!!

Dave said...

Kids TV is pretty awful, but I think the greater danger is the way it conforms children into image, success and consumerism. Is Harry Potter an entrance into this?

Christian Kids channel, I think there is one, I think the kids are encouraged to give a tithe offering of their smarties on the promise that they will be blessed with a family bag of Skittles...sorry, that was a sideswipe at TBN (let it go dave)

Religion in other versions is translated 'superstition' and it seems there is different Greek words that were used. Not sure of the difference off hand though.

My gripe is against religion that enslaves and oppresses and conforms people...I have no problem with pure religion.
Peterson puts it well from James 1:27 Anyone who sets himself up as "religious" by talking a good game is self-deceived. This kind of religion is hot air and only hot air. Real religion, the kind that passes muster before God the Father, is this: Reach out to the homeless and loveless in their plight, and guard against corruption from the godless world.

To the exile in babylon I say 'come out from among them'

dinsy said...

WARNING: This post is not flame bait, I stand by everything I have written here.

What makes me mad about all this "Harry Potter induces occultism" stuff is the number of christians that say that, and then go and watch Lord of the Rings, and the Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe, take all the kids/youth from the church to watch them and then do a bible study on it afterwards. And then slag off magic and tarot cards as being occult and demonic.

There are some practitioners of Wicca that I would far rather associate with than a lot of people who call themselves christians. "And it harm none, do what you will" doesn't seem such a bad thing to run your life on if you are unable or unwilling to believe in what you have heard about Jesus.

mm, I hope you are not saying the whole of the catholic church is evil?

Shieldsy, how is Harry Potter replacing a brick at a time hardwon christian cultural values? I've been told it is all about good versus evil, though it reads like Jennings and Darbyshire with broomsticks to me (I got bored after the second book, it was pretty much a rewrite of the first).

I would agree it is replacing literary values a brick at a time, but then I find her very childish. What do you think about Terry Pratchet's Discworld series or Pullman's "His Dark Materials" trilogy?

Gill, how are the kids tv magic stuff any different to fairy tales? (magic mirrors - snow white, good and evil fairy godmothers - sleeping beauty, magically transforming pumpkins into coaches - cinderella etc, etc).

Shieldsy said...

Hi Dinsy, didn't really want to start a Harry Potter/Da Vinci Code debate. Too many column inches devoted to those else where.

For my part, the difference between Harry Potter & Da Vinci code and other books that involve magical/fairy-tale elements is this ... the Da Vinci Code & Harry Potter weave REAL facts with fictional . Harry Potter contains real occult practices ... DVC includes real historical information. But then they surround these with fiction & fantasy. They very deliberately (in my opinion) try to blur the boundaries of fact & fiction. On a mental & spiritual level it's the same thing that paedophiles do when grooming ... start mixing unsavoury things with pleasent things to condition the child.

"And it harm none, do what you will" ... sounds great, and is the philosphy many would say they live by. Problem is that EVERY action has a consequence for someone else or for society as a whole. No man is an island. And there is a very good reason the Lord forbids dealing with the spiritual realm - because we really don't know what we're meddling with.

dinsy said...

Hi Shieldsy, thanks for the response. As to the Da Vinci code, I have nothing to say, I have no interest in it. You say "Harry Potter contains real occult practices" - what do you mean? Spells that work, recipes for real magic potions, devil worship, or what? (Or worse?)

Slightly off topic, what side of the Dungeons and Dragons divide do you come down on? - might help me to understand where you are coming from a bit better.

You are very right in what you say about all actions having consequences that affect other people, but at least people who live by the rule of not intentionally harming anyone are at least thinking of (maybe some of) the consequences of their actions. We all unintentionally and probably unknowingly hurt people from time to time, even those of us who try to follow eg. the sermon on the mount teachings. But I would rather have to do with people who are prepared to try and minimise this.

I agree wholeheartedly that we don't know what we are dealing with, with regard to the spiritual realm, but suspect you and I differ slightly on what constitutes "dealing with".

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